David, don’t put this one on your CV. Seriously. He’s right: for absence of reasoning, inability to put paragraphs together, and a genuinely nasty attitude towards your students, it’s that bad.

And you IHE editors should know better. You’ve already got enough of a credibility problem without publishing badly written foolishness like Galef’s.

Jonesy, at 8:07 am EDT on June 12, 2005

all talk

As the Phantom Professor has just begun to demonstrate, most academics really don’t care about plagerism. If they did, all papers would be posted to the web, and everyone could see the product that supposedly “elite” schools turn out. But, they don’t.

Instead, most academics look the other way.

If anyone in here disagrees with me, please post a list of students that you have caught plagiarizing and the consequences they faced.

Larry, at 10:44 am EDT on June 13, 2005

Consented class websites violate FERPA ?

Professor Dresner, I should note that there is nothing wrong under the FERPA (or the regs) with requiring consent from the student (at the time of registration) before posting his own work on a proprietary website (as opposed to posting the grade). If you can show me how I am misreading the statute, please do. I understand that you have practiced in this area for 15 years, whereas my sporadic 8-year practice in this area may leave me with a few gaps in my knowledge.

The fact is that schools don’t want other people seeing just how miserably bad the work their undergraduates do is, nor do they want students challenging grades that were awarded on the basis of favoritism by showing how their work compares to others.

Larry, at 8:57 am EDT on June 14, 2005

Copyright

I feel you both have missed the point to this. If you submit/post my paper to a website or submit my paper to a plagiarism detection agent (web-based or not) without my written consent or knowledge, I will sue you for copyright infringement. My paper is my work and not the property of the professor nor the institution I attend. Even if the paper is archived by the professor or the institution and never used, the act of archiving, in my opinion, may be considered copyright infringement.

Brian Stewart, EdD Candidate at Nova Southeastern University, at 3:14 pm EDT on June 14, 2005

Okay, Tim, if my view is “grossly oversimplistic” why don’t you explain to the nuances of your view. Maybe you can tell me when you will look the other way about cheaters. Or, why don’t you explain to me how undergraduate cheating appears to be accepted. From my perspective, most professors can’t be bothered. There are exceptions, but most of the time, professors make excuses. My favorite one regarding an undergraduate who plagiarized over 30 pages, “Yes, I know she copied, but to expose it now will destroy her academic career.” Another one of my favorites is “It is too late.”

Maybe you can tell me why it would be bad taste to provide a list of cheaters? Is there so social norm that requires professors to protect these liars ?

As to my assertion that “The fact is that schools don’t want other people seeing just how miserably bad the work their undergraduates do is...” this assertion was: 1) based on my prior experience (as an undergrad, graduate student, and in other capacities); 2) also supported by literature that is commonly read our community (such as the Phantom Professor.) Yes, this is what I “think,” but just about all of human knowledge of what constitutes a “fact” is based on such observations. So, in “fact” if just about any time someone says that something is a “fact” you can really say that “they just think so.” Now, you seem to “think” that something else is true, but if you “thinking” disagrees with my “thinking” that does not elevate it to the level of “fact.”

Brian, being threatened with a lawsuit doesn’t really frighten me, and it shouldn’t threaten any professors. First of all, in the US, it is quite permissible to make copies of academic works for certain limited purposes. Although I do not specialize in IP issues, I assure you that, as a litigator, my exposure to what constitutes “fair use” is somewhat greater than a graduate student running around claiming that you will “sue” people. Second of all, it is permissible to require students to agree to submit their work to a website where others will read it. (It may not, however, be acceptable, to require that students consent to a posting of their grades.) If you have ever sued anyone for making 20 copies of your work and sharing them with all of the members of a class, please tell me. Also, provide the docket numbers. As for me, I have never had any problem sharing everything I write with everyone in my class, and I freely post my work to my website (except if the publisher won’t let me reserve that right). I have made my work available to all those who ask (with a copyright) because unlike the vast majority of students, I never felt embarrassed by my work.

Larry, at 10:41 am EDT on June 17, 2005